MindfulText Perspectives Episode 1: Mindfulness in Work and Life with Holly Montalban

Mark Montalban 0:05
Hi, my name is Mark Montalban. And I'm your host for this MindfulText Perspectives series.

For our first interview, I thought it would be great to introduce my wife, Holly. She has been instrumental in my own progress in the mindfulness meditation and well being space, she introduced the topic to myself and my family actually, over 10 years ago. And it's been a huge contributor to my success, and even her success, and many of the people around me success, both personally and professionally. It was the inspiration for my own journey into this lifelong focus on wellness, and among other catalytic experiences. And to date, there's so much more to learn from this topic, many more organizations, and people are starting to understand the benefits of just being mindful and integrating wellness ideas into their lives. So, you know, this is something that we continue to work on every day. And I thought it'd be great to have Holly be our first person that we interview.

So Holly, how did you first encounter mindfulness, and how do you define it?

Holly Montalban 1:53
Yeah, well, thank you for having me on to share a little bit more about my story. And as you mentioned, I really encountered mindfulness a long time ago, when I was growing up. So as a kid, I was a bit of a warrior, I definitely had some anxiety growing up, and was challenged with that. And so as I learned to deal with that, I ended up going to therapy as a teenager, and what I learned there was, how to look at my thoughts objectively, and that I didn't need to just be inside of my thoughts, experiencing them and just being them. And I realized that I could take a step back, I could look at my thoughts subjectively. And I could decide if I wanted to be thinking and reacting in that way. Or if there was a different way that I wanted to be. And I learned there were tools that I could use to influence those moods and influence my anxiety and how to take more control of it. And so all of that, really, it was just such a liberating experience.

For me, realizing that I wasn't just a victim of something like anxiety, there were all these factors in my control that I could take advantage of, to get on top of this. And so for me, you know, mindfulness just played into that in such a big way. It's all about mindfulness to me is all about awareness and non judgment. And so, going to therapy in those early years gave me that awareness of my thoughts and that I didn't have before. And then the non judgment aspect that's hard to not judge your thoughts, but it does help you accept them, and then you're more free to determine a path forward. That is more in your benefit.

So to me, I think, you know, mindfulness it I constantly think about it as that awareness and non judgement. But just growing up that understanding of being able to look at thoughts, emotions, feelings, more objectively, was just such a great experience. And I felt like other people could benefit so much from that when you have that moment of realization that you have more control over your mental state than you might have thought. It's It's a great feeling, and it's definitely something that I've wanted to share. share with others.

Mark Montalban 5:01
Yeah, let's think about that a little bit, you touched on a bunch of different topics, from anxiety to therapy, to how you've used it different tools and tactics. And the first part that I think is interesting is this idea of anxiety in general, a lot of people, at least when I was growing up, we weren't taught how to deal with anxiety. I went to a private school, where we had to go to church every Friday. And basically, my parents told me to pray, right, I didn't have access to therapy. My, my main form of coping actually was playing video games. So anytime I felt stress, I wanted to play video games. And, you know, so going back to this idea that dealing with stress isn't really addressed, especially when we're younger. Although now, a lot more schools in California, for example, in the United States are starting to have kids practice mindfulness and meditation, there's a set of schools that are replacing detention, for example, with meditation. So instead of having a negative reinforcement, put upon our children, we're teaching them how to reflect, for example, and that's kind of this larger idea of how to approach anxiety and stress and the right ways to approach anxiety and stress because there's so many different ways to cope, so to speak. And maybe you can share a little bit more about your thoughts of anxiety and stress. And maybe, maybe if you have an example of some ways that you've addressed it.

Holly Montalban 6:50
yeah, I think I can definitely relate to what you said at the beginning of your when you were brought up, you were not taught to think about anxiety in the way that we do today. And I was in a similar situation, definitely. Growing up as I think most people are. And for you, you were taught the religion aspect, you learned the, you know, escape route of video games, like a lot of people do. It's how do I get away from this feeling? And how do I feel better, and they don't know how to do that by processing and thinking through it. And I think for me, it I just didn't think that anxiety was something everybody dealt with. For me, it seemed like something was wrong with me. And there was like, an illness or some issue that other people in my family or friends didn't have. It wasn't talked about much. And so at the beginning, it was hard to even address that and say, Hey, I feel like something's going on, I need to go to therapy, and I was lucky enough to have access to that. Like you said, you didn't have access to that. And that's same today for a lot of people too. But people are integrating those coping mechanisms and those techniques into schools, like you said, and even into the workplace, for sure. But I think, to your question, I have an example of a way that tools that I've used to help with anxiety, a couple of things come to mind right away. And the first thing that comes to mind is was one of those early realizations I had as a teenager when I opened up this book on natural healing and your diet, and I read that sugar can create an exacerbate anxiety. And it seems so simple. It seems like something we we really know now, but at the time, I had never made that connection and thought about that. And I was eating a lot of sugar. And I realized that was one thing that was very much in my power to control that can have an impact over this. So one of the first things was my diet. But the other really important thing that comes to mind is breathing exercises. That has helped me more than maybe anything else I've tried. It's so powerful. And I think just learning that when you're anxious, maybe you're holding your breath, maybe you're restricting oxygen to your body. And that is a very physical real sensation that can make you more anxious. And just understanding or maybe you're holding your breath, maybe you're breathing too fast. Maybe you're breathing too shallow, whatever it is bringing some of that awareness into your breathing patterns can just be real instrumental in getting past those moments of anxiety and feeling wrapped up in it, that one breath can just give you a moment where you step back, you can take a look at what's happening. And you can decide, do I want to respond in the way that my body is currently responding? Or do I want to choose how I'd like to react. And so that breathing has been huge for me. And I think that's something that a lot of other people see the benefits of pretty quickly when they start learning mindfulness and meditation.

Mark Montalban 10:43
Breathing is such a simple concept that people don't understand how it relates to mindfulness and meditation and wellness off the bat. But there's a lot of scientific research now, like even recently going into this idea of breathing, it's, it's called Holotropic Breathing. And this idea of just having control over your breath, is now being researched and proved scientifically, that it helps our immune system it helps our cognitive processes, it helps so much. When you think about how you breathe, most people actually breathe shallowly. And when you're in a stressful moment, or you're stressed out, it's very helpful to just check in with yourself and do what's called in the mindfulness meditation space is a body scan, or you just pay attention to your insides. How are you feeling? Are you breathing shallowly? I reading too fast, are you breathing into the diaphragm? So, you know, that's a whole other topic for another time. But just this idea, I really love how you brought up that idea of how breathing is one of the best tools to cope with anxiety, and stress. And it's true, because when deep breath can releases the stress from your body, the cortisol, and you know, just try it right now take a deep breath. I already feel better, just taking that one deep breath. And people don't, haven't started applying this practice to the lives. But definitely, it's it's one of the first things that you learn when you're learning mindfulness, or learning meditation, just being more aware of your breath, which I find super interesting, super simple to do, but hard to incorporate into your habits.

Holly Montalban 12:35
Yeah, definitely. And it's one of the first things you learn. But it's also one of the things that you keep doing for years and years that you keep learning. I mean, it's, there are certain things that I learned going through therapy that you I don't necessarily need to keep doing. Maybe I've learned a concept and that got ingrained. And then I didn't need to keep coming back to that. But with breathing, you learn it. And it just stays there as this tool that's always accessible for you, and always really powerful. And that's something I love about it. Because there are so many other things you can benefit benefit from in therapy, like cognitive behavioral therapy, where you can really change habits and rewrite your neural pathways. And those those things are great. And often, you might bring a little bit of that through for yours later on. But the idea is hopefully that you've addressed a habit or an issue, and then you can move on. But the breathing thing, it's just you can benefit from it every day. And I feel like I never have I there are never too many reminders for me to take a deep breath and just bring that awareness and take a step back.

Mark Montalban 14:04
I love that. So we're getting into this topic now of tools and tactics and ways that we can improve our well being and wellness and apply more wellness practice to our lives. And I'm wondering to focus our next question, how you have used these practices in the workplace.

Holly Montalban 14:25
Yeah, well, I think that a lot of people who have anxiety, they often tend to be hard workers. It's not always the case. But you do find that a lot of you know, high achievers, they often come with things like anxiety and they're learning to deal with that. I think I inherited a little bit of a workaholic tendency for my mom who is an awesome businesswoman. And I could do a whole other session on her but we'll leave that for another day. And I think that having that hard work ethic that really strong work ethic is, is such a great thing. But it can lead people to burnout for sure. And so I think I was always trying to be a pretty high achiever. And so in order to balance that, and really work hard on something, but not burnout, mindfulness is just an amazing tool. I think that it helps me pause and bring awareness to certain things throughout my workday. So if I'm working really hard on a project, and I noticed that I just haven't been eating as well, or I've just been getting quick, sugary things as a snack to keep me going or having a lot of coffee, and just so focused in my work that I'm not really thinking well, about, you know, what I'm eating, then just being able to have a mindful moment and say, Okay, I'm feeling really jittery, I'm feeling kind of like anxious right now, what did I put into my body today? Was it just coffee was it coffee and something sweet in the morning, which is obviously going to set me up for a day with a little more anxiety in it, and then being able to recognize that helps me see, okay, I know what I should be putting into my body for the rest of the day to help so that I don't just exacerbate this. Or just knowing when you have a busy period coming up and mentally preparing for that, or even a meeting that you know, is going to be stressful, before going into that being able to pause and take a deep breath and bring a little bit of mindful awareness can help you reduce that stress. So I would say, you know, stress is something that pretty much everybody has dealt with, especially in the workplace, it's such a big thing. And there are multiple ways that mindfulness can help reduce that stress and help you be productive, still be a high achiever, but not burnout, and not ignore all those little signs from your body. Trying to tell you, you know, I need to rest now I need to take some time I need to drink some water. Whatever it is, I think that one of the main ways I would say mindfulness has helped me in my career is just with stress management. I've definitely worked in some situations that are pretty high stress and pretty demanding work environments, especially in the startup world, not everybody is cut out for that kind of work environment. And and so I think, you know, it's easy to fall into that stress and anxiety when you are in high stress situations at work. But being able to do the breathing exercises, be in touch with my body, you know, my diet, all of those things, really helps with managing the stress. But it's not just burnout and stress that mindfulness can help with when it comes to, to your career. I think another way that it has been really instrumental for me is through learning, mindful communication.

Mark Montalban 18:50
Before we get into that topic, let's touch a little bit about some of the main points that you were touching on. And one of the biggest things that I'd like to bring up for our audience here is this idea. That's really the first step of mindfulness. And even before that, like let's frame mindfulness little because some people are a little put off on this idea of mindfulness, like what is mindfulness? Is it religious? Is it not religious? I personally view mindfulness in a very secular way. I, you know, I mentioned I grew up religious, my parents were really religious, they forced me to go to church every Sunday at 7:30am growing up, which was pretty intense. But today, you know, I'm very open to all those ideas. But from a mindfulness perspective, I like to look at it from a very secular point of view, and a very scientific point of view, because there's a lot of research going into the space, and even the clinical space and one of the first things that people are taught to learn from that secular and scientific View is this idea of awareness, right? Like, people get so lost in burnout, it's so easy to just continue on the grind, and let yourself burn out. But one of the ways to mitigate stress and burnout and anxiety is to first practice this idea of awareness. And that is probably one of the hardest practices, I think. And mindfulness is just building that level of awareness and taking that level of awareness around with you. So that you know, when you're eating sugar, or you're keeping track of when you're eating things, might not be sugar, it could be other things that they're in impacting your body. So being aware of what you're eating, being aware of the things that you're watching, or the things that you're reading, or how much time you're spending on social media, to that that's increasing your stress, perhaps, and understanding is this person that I'm following on social media or this thing that I'm doing or this thing that I'm eating? Is it contributing to my stress, and having this underlying awareness of how things in your environment are impacting you, I think, is part of the main point that you were addressing just having this overall awareness of things impacting us.

Holly Montalban 21:27
Yeah. And I think that awareness is something that if you don't have it, by being mindful, for example, and questioning these things for yourself, at some point, you will probably become aware of the issue because it has reached a boiling point. So we've talked about diet weight, that's one example. Social media is another example. Another thing could just be how well are you balancing your work life and your relationships? And are you giving enough time to your family and your friends where, you know, you're getting that good balance between work and home. And that's a great example of something that can come to your awareness by imploding without you catching it earlier by using mindfulness. So what I mean by that is, somebody who's not practicing mindful awareness, and working really hard, they might be neglecting those relationships. And it might, they might only become aware of it when somebody in their family gets really upset with them, some some friendship deteriorates, or something happens, where it's really in their face, and they have to deal with it now. And it's a problem. That's when most people take care of these kinds of issues. So when you're using mindfulness, you can start catching these things, before it has escalated to that point of burnout, or a relationship getting messed up, or you're having a health issue because your diet is really poor, or you're just not getting enough sleep, and that's causing you to get sick. So if you're mindful, and you're kind of thinking about these things, and questioning them along the way, you can say, Okay, well, I feel like I have had a little less time with family lately, maybe they're starting to want to hang out with me a little more that's getting neglected, I'll I'll do something about that now, and prevent it from going down this path of exploding, which is going to end up causing more pain and causing you more time and stopping you from being productive, down the line even more.

Mark Montalban 24:00
So that's an awesome byproduct of practicing awareness, just knowing how it impacts the rest of your life. And it's kind of an outline of how wellness is such an important topic now because it connects everything in our lives. Like there's this idea of work life balance, where you keep work separate from life, but in reality, it's all connected. What you eat at home impacts how you perform at work. What you do at work impacts your relationships when you get home. So I love how we're exploring all these ideas.

Holly Montalban 24:39
And and going back to that point that you were talking about with religion and how mindfulness might have a bit of a stigma around it for seven people. I think some people take mindfulness concepts, they connected to Buddhism or they connect it to Any other religion, you name it, um, that a lot of people can take these concepts and intertwine them with their own faith based belief systems. And I think that is not a bad thing, I think that anybody's spreading the word of mindfulness is generally it's gonna, it's gonna have a positive impact. But I do agree with you that I think we look at it in a in a more secular way, where I always just keep coming back to this definition, that it's awareness and non judgment. And that's really what it is, there are a ton of mindfulness practice practices that help you get there. But at the core, it's this concept of awareness, non judgment, and that brings acceptance with it. It brings a lot of different positive things with it that don't need to be connected to any religion, but they can be applied by any type of people, any people of any religion can still utilize mindfulness techniques in their own way,

Mark Montalban 26:13
Yes, so, just this idea, let's define mindfulness now. So there's this idea of awareness and non judgment. And both of those ideas are completely massive. And there's so many different ways to apply those things. And it takes a lot of practice, actually, to apply awareness to non judgement, we've talked a lot about awareness and how it applies to the workplace and how it can impact stress, and anxiety, and even your immune system, for example. So you know, we've talked about awareness. But now let's maybe spend a little time on this idea of non judgement, which encompasses mindfulness, right, mindfulness is awareness without judgment. So we can, we can be aware of what we're eating, what we're consuming mentally, how we're interacting with people, right, but the next step is also just as important, right, like, after we perceive what we're doing after communicating with people after we're eating, it's important, or it's a very good practice to apply non judgement to that, because we can be a lot of people can be very harsh on themselves. That's also another negative form of being right. Like if we're too overly harsh on ourselves. That's almost just as bad as somebody else attacking us. So that's kind of my first thought, when it comes to non judgement. On some of the ideas we're talking about, like how do you perceive your awareness? And it should be based on this practice of mindfulness - it's recommended to not judge yourself for what you're perceiving, which is a whole interesting other topic that mindfulness touches on.

Holly Montalban 28:06
Yeah, definitely, I think, if you have awareness, now, you've recognized that you can take that step back, you can look at something objectively. So that first part in itself gives you so much power, that awareness aspect of it, you're no longer just in it. But then adding on the non judgement part is super important. Because once you become aware, what you can do is obviously beat yourself up about it, like you said, people are harsh on themselves -

Mark Montalban 28:40
That increases stress even more.

Holly Montalban 28:42
- that increases stress and it doesn't really help you find a productive path forward. So if you can be aware, maybe you're now aware of a habit that you do that you don't really love. And if you spend too much time beating yourself up about it, you're just wasting all that energy on that instead of what can I do differently. So once you become aware, say your problem might be interrupting people all the time. And then you become aware of it, you might realize, wow, I interrupt people all the time. That's horrible. I'm not a great person to have in conversation because of it. And you could just feel really bad. But instead, you apply non judgement now and you say to yourself, hey, that's okay. That's I'm going to not judge that aspect of myself. I'm going to accept it. And now choose how I want to be differently. If you get too caught up in judging, it's hard to reach that point of acceptance and moving on. And so being able to have non judgment will help lead you to accepting these things and then taking a different path and so that that's why the combination of the two is really so powerful.

Mark Montalban 30:00
That's awesome. There's so many other topics we could talk about today. I love how we wrapped everything up with this idea of awareness and non judgement and just sharing some cases of how we apply them and other examples. But since we're at the end of our 30 minutes here, I'd love to hear from you if you have a top recommendation or a tip for our audience here to end on.

Holly Montalban 30:30
Yeah, I think what I would love for people to leave this with is just a sense of empowerment, that mindfulness can just be freeing and really can help you be more the person you want to be. It can make you be healthy, be happy and more peaceful. But not just all that it can help you be more productive. And I think people think about mindfulness, they think about meditation, they think you know, that that would be great if I lived out in the woods didn't really have a job to worry about, and could just meditate all day. And that sounds really nice. But that's not the reality of most of our lives. And so I think what's great about mindfulness is that you can apply it in your day to day life, you don't need to be out in some other environment, where you're not in the regular, you know, parts of society in order to really take advantage of it. So I think what I'd love for people to take away is just knowing that, that it's, mindfulness can give you these tools that can just give you back the power, I guess, in your life, and not give all that power to your reactions and your, your emotions and whatever it just happened to be that you can actually use mindfulness and these practices to take that position of leadership in your life that you should be taking, that you deserve to take. And that it's really not that hard. It starts with these little things like taking a deep breath, like we talked about analyzing, being aware of your, your thoughts, it's really those little things that can lead to some huge transformations. And for me, it really has I know for you, it has been pretty instrumental as well. And and that it can be helpful for somebody who is career minded to that it can be integrated into your life and and your career and really help you in all of those aspects.

Mark Montalban 32:59
Holly, thank you so much for spending some time today with M on our perspectives, podcasts. Thank you very much, and we look forward to chatting with you all next time.